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Re: [SurroundSound] Re: foobar and SACD-Rs August Bleed Mon Feb 20 13:00:20 2012

Oh I have the Yamaha RXV-2065 which is the top of the line mid priced
receiver from 2009 or 2010.  It was around 1300 at the time when it first
was introduced.  It's now much cheaper.  I got mine about a year and a half
ago for around 600 bucks.  Seemed like a good deal as it is quite musical.
Not the best DACs but implementation isn't so bad.  There is a burr brown
supposedly for each channel.  It also supposedly puts out DSD.  The info on
the DACs in the unit is a bit hard to find.  I have a couple possibilities
for what is inside but there isn't a great deal of info.  I have heard both
things about the unit.  One group said it does pure DSD.  Others have said
it just lights up the light.  Like I said I have everything set for bit
perfect playback regardless of source.  So it theoretically should work.
 Again unless there is some foolery going on in the amp.  In which case if
I am streaming to the Oppo over say foobar then it should put out DSD
right?  At least at the Oppo level.  Or am I just totally off here?  I
should have prefaced by saying I'm not an audio guru but I seem to have a
general understanding of most stuff.  At least fundamentally.  Hence the
confusion.

On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 10:36 AM, realafrica <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> August what exactly is your DSD capable amp?
> There was a list here of all amps receivers that really did do DSD and
> those that did some foolery as you put it.
> Since Google made changes to it's G Groups we may not have it here any
> more, but we should have the list backed up over on HRON.
>
> On Feb 20, 5:03 pm, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I have a collection of about 100 SACDs.  They all play properly.  MC and
> > stereo.  In DSD.  While I cannot be certain there isn't some kind of
> > foolery going on internally in the amp, all indications say that it is
> > indeed outputting DSD and was in fact designed to do that.  It is one of
> > the reasons I bought it.  The Oppo was on a short list when I discovered
> MC
> > music and I had a Pioneer mid range model that wouldn't pump my B&Ws and
> > wouldn't play SACDs natively.  Again unless there is some foolery going
> on
> > all indications seem to point to it being a DSD capable receiver.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 8:55 AM, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > > Everything is OFF.  I honestly get DSD and what I need to do.  The
> > > software just doesn't do it.  The amp does just fine, the Oppo does
> just
> > > fine.  The room correction software has never given me satisfactory
> results
> > > so only the most rudimentary stuff is running.  Set to Pure Mode.  No
> room
> > > EQ.  No EQ at all.  DSD capable receiver.  Oppo sounds better passing
> the
> > > DSD so I let it.  It shows as DSD on the amp.  It sounds noticeably
> > > different when I tell the Oppo to output PCM.  I don't think it would
> > > output DSD if something in the chain was incapable of handling it.  Or
> am I
> > > really missing something?
> >
> > > On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 8:09 AM, scolumbo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > >> In most DSD capable receivers, if any EQ or room correction is
> > >> applied, the receiver will convert to PCM first. So, even if you are
> > >> outputting DSD from your player or soundcard, you must use a Direct or
> > >> similar setting in the receiver that bypasses any EQ, bass management,
> > >> etc.  For my room, SQ is improved using Audyssey so I prefer using DSD
> > >> converted to PCM and then having room correction applied versus DSD
> > >> direct to analog from the Oppo to my Denon 3808.
> >
> > >> On Feb 18, 9:39 pm, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >> > Dunno about that.  Maybe on the software side.  DSD over HDMI is
> pretty
> > >> > much the only way you got it until recently other than analog. Then
> the
> > >> > Mytek.  Oppo does it just fine.  Sounds great and you can absolutely
> > >> tell
> > >> > btw that and a PCM.  Even on mid fi set up like mine.  I can
> imagine the
> > >> > licensing of DSD itself is the killing point, not the hdmi
> transmission.
> >
> > >> > On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 6:22 PM, realafrica <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >> wrote:
> > >> > > Some better soundcard drivers often have DSP.
> > >> > > But I imagine there is all kind of CRM $h1t involved  with SACD
> output
> > >> > > over HDMI.
> > >> > > Hell, even an SACD capable PS3 will not output DSD without
> > >> > > downsampling it.
> >
> > >> > > On Feb 18, 8:22 pm, ArnoldLayne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >> > > > Hmm, I think DSD output over HDMI is managed by DSP, if so the
> > >> > > > implementation is very low level stuff. Does somebody know more
> > >> about
> > >> > > > this? Do soundcards have a DSP or is it a motherboard feature?
> >
> > >> > > > On 18 feb, 21:00, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > >> > > > > I have a DSD capable receiver.  It just doesn't get passed as
> DSD
> > >> to
> > >> > > the
> > >> > > > > receiver using the software.  Only the mytek works as far as i
> > >> know.
> >
> > >> > > > > On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 11:51 AM, ArnoldLayne <
> > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >> > > >wrote:
> >
> > >> > > > > > Many DSD capable receivers and players give you the options
> ot
> > >> decode
> > >> > > > > > to PCM or not before converting to analog. One prerequisite
> is
> > >> that
> > >> > > it
> > >> > > > > > has a DAC that handle DSD. Both the Burr Brown 1796 in my
> > >> receiver
> > >> > > and
> > >> > > > > > ES9018 Sabre in my Oppo player are in this cathegory. So far
> > >> I've
> > >> > > > > > found the BB 1796 less inferior for SACD than for PCM
> sources.
> >
> > >> > > > > > On 18 feb, 20:11, "Noreltny-gmail" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > Aren't most of the DSD capable receivers actually
> converting
> > >> the
> > >> > > DSD to
> > >> > > > > > PCM
> > >> > > > > > > on the fly? Isn't that what the Oppos do?
> >
> > >> > > > > > > I think you might be able to get DSD playback from a
> > >> multichannel
> > >> > > USB
> > >> > > > > > DAC,
> > >> > > > > > > like the exaSound (http://www.exasound.com/), but it also
> > >> costs
> > >> > > more
> > >> > > > > > than
> > >> > > > > > > your AVR.
> >
> > >> > > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:
> > >> > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >> > > > > > > On Behalf Of August Bleed
> > >> > > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 12:39 PM
> > >> > > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > >> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [SurroundSound] Re: foobar and SACD-Rs
> >
> > >> > > > > > > Thats what I thought and why I asked.  So the folks using
> > >> these
> > >> > > are only
> > >> > > > > > > getting stereo playback anyway correct?  Or is it similar
> to
> > >> > > bitstreaming
> > >> > > > > > > whereby the the DSD is sent similarly to DTS over spdif
> to get
> > >> > > > > > multichannel
> > >> > > > > > > where you'd previously only have 2 chan support?  I think
> > >> rather
> > >> > > > > > expensive
> > >> > > > > > > might be a slight understatement for me!  That baby is the
> > >> same
> > >> > > price as
> > >> > > > > > my
> > >> > > > > > > AVR!!  The whole point of the AVR (not ideal i get that)
> was
> > >> just
> > >> > > to be
> > >> > > > > > able
> > >> > > > > > > to not have to buy a dang DAC every 6 mos.  Plus I am a MC
> > >> guy...I
> > >> > > like
> > >> > > > > > > stereo but given the choice i'd obviously rather be
> listening
> > >> in 5
> > >> > > > > > channels.
> > >> > > > > > > Is there some technical limitation for this?  Given that
> > >> there are
> > >> > > lots
> > >> > > > > > of
> > >> > > > > > > DSD capable receivers out there it seems kinda strange
> that
> > >> the
> > >> > > signal
> > >> > > > > > > couldn't be passed over HDMI.  In fact, I would think
> that's
> > >> what
> > >> > > the
> > >> > > > > > > content providers would prefer as it is 'protected'.  Any
> > >> ideas
> > >> > > why this
> > >> > > > > > > can't happen?
> >
> > >> > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 10:07 AM, realafrica <
> > >> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >> > > > > > wrote:
> >
> > >> > > > > > > You would need a Mytek sound card for the DSD they are
> rather
> > >> > > > > > > expensive.
> >
> > >> > > > > > > On Feb 16, 11:42 pm, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > If you are using an HDMI sound card and a receiver that
> > >> does DSD
> > >> > > can
> > >> > > > > > you
> > >> > > > > > > > not output pure DSD or is this only for those with DSD
> DACs
> > >> via
> > >> > > USB
> > >> > > > > > and/or
> > >> > > > > > > > Firewire?  I am excited about these developments but it
> > >> seems
> > >> > > the only
> > >> > > > > > way
> > >> > > > > > > > to utilize these solutions is to have a usb DAC which
> > >> leaves out
> > >> > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > multichannel folks and those who aren't into converted
> DSD
> > >> to
> > >> > > PCM.  I
> > >> > > > > > > > haven't ever really been all that impressed with generic
> > >> results
> > >> > > from
> > >> > > > > > > > conversions done outside the 'studio' so to speak.  Even
> > >> then
> > >> > > they seem
> > >> > > > > > > > lacking the intricacies of their pure DSD counterparts
> > >> (even if
> > >> > > the
> > >> > > > > > > > receiver only does a so so job or even converted to PCM
> > >> > > > > > internally--mine
> > >> > > > > > > > claims to do pure DSD and it sounds different when PCM
> is
> > >> output
> > >> > > but I
> > >> > > > > > > cant
> > >> > > > > > > > be sure there isn't an internal conversion going on
> anyway.
> > >>  At
> > >> > > any
> > >> > > > > > rate
> > >> > > > > > > > has anyone found anything useful for AVR DSD
> reproduction
> > >> via
> > >> > > foobar or
> > >> > > > > > > > anything else?
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 7:21 AM, realafrica <
> > >> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >> > > > > > wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > Peter in the scenario you describe above you will find
> > >> that
> > >> > > your
> > >> > > > > > > > > settings in foobar are to play 44.1 so you get 44.1
> out
> > >> put.
> > >> > > > > > > > > You need to find the right place in foo to change
> this to
> > >> > > something
> > >> > > > > > > > > more appropriate for you.
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > Open foo.
> > >> > > > > > > > > On the Library tab left click and select Configure,
> now
> > >> scroll
> > >> > > down
> > >> > > > > > > > > the left pane to find 'SACD'.....left click this and
> set
> > >> with:
> > >> > > > > > > > > ASIO Driver mode = PCM (As you are not using a DSD
> sound
> > >> card)
> > >> > > > > > > > > PCM volume = +0dB
> > >> > > > > > > > > PCM Samplerate = either 88200 (or 176400 if you think
> the
> > >> > > album you
> > >> > > > > > > > > are playing has music up there)
> > >> > > > > > > > > DSD"PCM Mode = Multistage (Floating-point)
> > >> > > > > > > > > Preferable area = to show you in foo the 5.1 only
> track
> > >> or the
> > >> > > stereo
> > >> > > > > > > > > only
> > >> > > > > > > > > Edited Master Playback =  tick/check selected
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > On Feb 16, 2:09 pm, "Peter Cawthron" <
> > >> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > >> > > > > > > > > wrote:
> > >> > > > > > > > > > I found it via this group. See:
> >
> > >> > >
> http://groups.google.com/group/surroundsound/browse_thread/thread/2d3.
> > >> > > > > > ..
> > >> > > > > > > > > > 795dc1
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > P.
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > >> > > > > > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:
> > >> > > > > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Marktherob2005
> > >> > > > > > > > > > Sent: 16 February 2012 13:53
> > >> > > > > > > > > > To: SurroundSound
> > >> > > > > > > > > > Subject: [SurroundSound] Re: foobar and SACD-Rs
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > > ... I have an oppo 981HD and it plays only SACD not
> > >> SACD-R
> > >> > > .... Did
> > >> > > > > > > you
> > >> > > > > > > > > get
> > >> > > > > > > > > > your firmware from oppo or a 3rd party.
> >
> > >> > > > > > > > > --
> > >> > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed
> to
> > >> the
> > >> > > Google
> > >> > > > > > > Groups
> > >> > > > > > > > > "SurroundSound" group.
> > >> > > > > > > > > To post to this group, send email to
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> > >> > > > > > > > > For more
> >
> > ...
> >
> > read more ยป
>
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-- 
August
Bleed, Inc.
Selling Art Is Tying Your Ego To a Leash And Walking It Like a Dog

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