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Re: [SurroundSound] Re: foobar and SACD-Rs Steven Sullivan Mon Feb 20 15:00:43 2012

If set to PCM your Oppo will convert at 88/24 -- that's a bandwidth up to
44kHz -- and I would expect an AVR to convert to that (or higher) as well,
so, assuming absolutely every other DSP in your setup is OFF, there really
shouldn't be an audible difference between it and DSD.  In that case I
doubt you are missing anything in either mode.


> Everything is OFF.  I honestly get DSD and what I need to do.  The
> software
> just doesn't do it.  The amp does just fine, the Oppo does just fine.  The
> room correction software has never given me satisfactory results so only
> the most rudimentary stuff is running.  Set to Pure Mode.  No room EQ.  No
> EQ at all.  DSD capable receiver.  Oppo sounds better passing the DSD so I
> let it.  It shows as DSD on the amp.  It sounds noticeably different when
> I
> tell the Oppo to output PCM.  I don't think it would output DSD if
> something in the chain was incapable of handling it.  Or am I really
> missing something?
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 8:09 AM, scolumbo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> In most DSD capable receivers, if any EQ or room correction is
>> applied, the receiver will convert to PCM first. So, even if you are
>> outputting DSD from your player or soundcard, you must use a Direct or
>> similar setting in the receiver that bypasses any EQ, bass management,
>> etc.  For my room, SQ is improved using Audyssey so I prefer using DSD
>> converted to PCM and then having room correction applied versus DSD
>> direct to analog from the Oppo to my Denon 3808.
>>
>> On Feb 18, 9:39 pm, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> > Dunno about that.  Maybe on the software side.  DSD over HDMI is
>> pretty
>> > much the only way you got it until recently other than analog. Then
>> the
>> > Mytek.  Oppo does it just fine.  Sounds great and you can absolutely
>> tell
>> > btw that and a PCM.  Even on mid fi set up like mine.  I can imagine
>> the
>> > licensing of DSD itself is the killing point, not the hdmi
>> transmission.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 6:22 PM, realafrica <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>> > > Some better soundcard drivers often have DSP.
>> > > But I imagine there is all kind of CRM $h1t involved  with SACD
>> output
>> > > over HDMI.
>> > > Hell, even an SACD capable PS3 will not output DSD without
>> > > downsampling it.
>> >
>> > > On Feb 18, 8:22 pm, ArnoldLayne <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> > > > Hmm, I think DSD output over HDMI is managed by DSP, if so the
>> > > > implementation is very low level stuff. Does somebody know more
>> about
>> > > > this? Do soundcards have a DSP or is it a motherboard feature?
>> >
>> > > > On 18 feb, 21:00, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >
>> > > > > I have a DSD capable receiver.  It just doesn't get passed as
>> DSD
>> to
>> > > the
>> > > > > receiver using the software.  Only the mytek works as far as i
>> know.
>> >
>> > > > > On Sat, Feb 18, 2012 at 11:51 AM, ArnoldLayne <
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > >wrote:
>> >
>> > > > > > Many DSD capable receivers and players give you the options ot
>> decode
>> > > > > > to PCM or not before converting to analog. One prerequisite is
>> that
>> > > it
>> > > > > > has a DAC that handle DSD. Both the Burr Brown 1796 in my
>> receiver
>> > > and
>> > > > > > ES9018 Sabre in my Oppo player are in this cathegory. So far
>> I've
>> > > > > > found the BB 1796 less inferior for SACD than for PCM sources.
>> >
>> > > > > > On 18 feb, 20:11, "Noreltny-gmail" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> > > > > > > Aren't most of the DSD capable receivers actually converting
>> the
>> > > DSD to
>> > > > > > PCM
>> > > > > > > on the fly? Isn't that what the Oppos do?
>> >
>> > > > > > > I think you might be able to get DSD playback from a
>> multichannel
>> > > USB
>> > > > > > DAC,
>> > > > > > > like the exaSound (http://www.exasound.com/), but it also
>> costs
>> > > more
>> > > > > > than
>> > > > > > > your AVR.
>> >
>> > > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:
>> > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > > > On Behalf Of August Bleed
>> > > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 17, 2012 12:39 PM
>> > > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > > > > > > Subject: Re: [SurroundSound] Re: foobar and SACD-Rs
>> >
>> > > > > > > Thats what I thought and why I asked.  So the folks using
>> these
>> > > are only
>> > > > > > > getting stereo playback anyway correct?  Or is it similar to
>> > > bitstreaming
>> > > > > > > whereby the the DSD is sent similarly to DTS over spdif to
>> get
>> > > > > > multichannel
>> > > > > > > where you'd previously only have 2 chan support?  I think
>> rather
>> > > > > > expensive
>> > > > > > > might be a slight understatement for me!  That baby is the
>> same
>> > > price as
>> > > > > > my
>> > > > > > > AVR!!  The whole point of the AVR (not ideal i get that) was
>> just
>> > > to be
>> > > > > > able
>> > > > > > > to not have to buy a dang DAC every 6 mos.  Plus I am a MC
>> guy...I
>> > > like
>> > > > > > > stereo but given the choice i'd obviously rather be
>> listening
>> in 5
>> > > > > > channels.
>> > > > > > > Is there some technical limitation for this?  Given that
>> there
>> are
>> > > lots
>> > > > > > of
>> > > > > > > DSD capable receivers out there it seems kinda strange that
>> the
>> > > signal
>> > > > > > > couldn't be passed over HDMI.  In fact, I would think that's
>> what
>> > > the
>> > > > > > > content providers would prefer as it is 'protected'.  Any
>> ideas
>> > > why this
>> > > > > > > can't happen?
>> >
>> > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 17, 2012 at 10:07 AM, realafrica <
>> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > > > > wrote:
>> >
>> > > > > > > You would need a Mytek sound card for the DSD they are
>> rather
>> > > > > > > expensive.
>> >
>> > > > > > > On Feb 16, 11:42 pm, August Bleed <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > > > > > > > If you are using an HDMI sound card and a receiver that
>> does
>> DSD
>> > > can
>> > > > > > you
>> > > > > > > > not output pure DSD or is this only for those with DSD
>> DACs
>> via
>> > > USB
>> > > > > > and/or
>> > > > > > > > Firewire?  I am excited about these developments but it
>> seems
>> > > the only
>> > > > > > way
>> > > > > > > > to utilize these solutions is to have a usb DAC which
>> leaves
>> out
>> > > the
>> > > > > > > > multichannel folks and those who aren't into converted DSD
>> to
>> > > PCM.  I
>> > > > > > > > haven't ever really been all that impressed with generic
>> results
>> > > from
>> > > > > > > > conversions done outside the 'studio' so to speak.  Even
>> then
>> > > they seem
>> > > > > > > > lacking the intricacies of their pure DSD counterparts
>> (even
>> if
>> > > the
>> > > > > > > > receiver only does a so so job or even converted to PCM
>> > > > > > internally--mine
>> > > > > > > > claims to do pure DSD and it sounds different when PCM is
>> output
>> > > but I
>> > > > > > > cant
>> > > > > > > > be sure there isn't an internal conversion going on
>> anyway.
>>  At
>> > > any
>> > > > > > rate
>> > > > > > > > has anyone found anything useful for AVR DSD reproduction
>> via
>> > > foobar or
>> > > > > > > > anything else?
>> >
>> > > > > > > > On Thu, Feb 16, 2012 at 7:21 AM, realafrica <
>> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > Peter in the scenario you describe above you will find
>> that
>> > > your
>> > > > > > > > > settings in foobar are to play 44.1 so you get 44.1 out
>> put.
>> > > > > > > > > You need to find the right place in foo to change this
>> to
>> > > something
>> > > > > > > > > more appropriate for you.
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > Open foo.
>> > > > > > > > > On the Library tab left click and select Configure, now
>> scroll
>> > > down
>> > > > > > > > > the left pane to find 'SACD'.....left click this and set
>> with:
>> > > > > > > > > ASIO Driver mode = PCM (As you are not using a DSD sound
>> card)
>> > > > > > > > > PCM volume = +0dB
>> > > > > > > > > PCM Samplerate = either 88200 (or 176400 if you think
>> the
>> > > album you
>> > > > > > > > > are playing has music up there)
>> > > > > > > > > DSD"PCM Mode = Multistage (Floating-point)
>> > > > > > > > > Preferable area = to show you in foo the 5.1 only track
>> or
>> the
>> > > stereo
>> > > > > > > > > only
>> > > > > > > > > Edited Master Playback =  tick/check selected
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > On Feb 16, 2:09 pm, "Peter Cawthron" <
>> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> > > > > > > > > wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > I found it via this group. See:
>> >
>> > >http://groups.google.com/group/surroundsound/browse_thread/thread/2d3.
>> > > > > > ..
>> > > > > > > > > > 795dc1
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > > P.
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > > > > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:
>> > > > > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > > On Behalf Of Marktherob2005
>> > > > > > > > > > Sent: 16 February 2012 13:53
>> > > > > > > > > > To: SurroundSound
>> > > > > > > > > > Subject: [SurroundSound] Re: foobar and SACD-Rs
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > > ... I have an oppo 981HD and it plays only SACD not
>> SACD-R
>> > > .... Did
>> > > > > > > you
>> > > > > > > > > get
>> > > > > > > > > > your firmware from oppo or a 3rd party.
>> >
>> > > > > > > > > --
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>> >
>> > > > > > > > --
>> > > > > > > > August
>> > > > > > > > Bleed, Inc.
>> > > > > > > > Selling Art Is Tying Your Ego To a Leash And Walking It
>> Like
>> a
>> > > Dog
>> >
>> > > > > > > --
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>> > > > > > > --
>> > > > > > > August
>> > > > > > > Bleed, Inc.
>> > > > > > > Selling Art Is Tying Your Ego To a Leash And Walking It Like
>> a
>> Dog
>> >
>> > > > > > > --
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>> > > > > > groups.google.com/group/SurroundSound- Ocultar texto de la
>> cita
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>> >
>> > > > > > > - Mostrar texto de la cita -
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>> > > > > Bleed, Inc.
>> > > > > Selling Art Is Tying Your Ego To a Leash And Walking It Like a
>> Dog-
>> > > Ocultar texto de la cita -
>> >
>> > > > > - Mostrar texto de la cita -
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>> > August
>> > Bleed, Inc.
>> > Selling Art Is Tying Your Ego To a Leash And Walking It Like a Dog
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> August
> Bleed, Inc.
> Selling Art Is Tying Your Ego To a Leash And Walking It Like a Dog
>
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